rocknrollsisyphus

We all go a little mod sometimes.
★ MOD
Feb 9, 2011
17,091
19,661
As most of you know, I'm mildly obsessive when it comes to prospects. I might watch more Minor League Baseball than Major League Baseball at this point, and I follow every prospect outlet incredibly closely throughout the year. I also have a few friends in the industry, and acted in a semi-scouting role for my high school and college teams (e.g., tracking pitches, using the radar gun, etc). I'm not a scout - far from it - but I'm as tuned into the prospects of every team as is humanly possible for someone with my schedule. And I absolutely love talking about prospects, as there's never really a lull there.

And for that, and considering how slow the off-season (and this board) has been, I thought this would be fun. The basic idea of this thread is simple: ask me prospect questions, and I'll answer them to the best of my ability. And if I can't answer it, I'll do some research and find one, or point you in the right direction. I'm inclined to say nothing is off limits, but that's not quite true. I'd like to avoid in-depth lists (I'm working on a top-100, but that takes time), and I try to shy away from prospect to player comps because I find them kind of lazy.

With all that said ... fire away.
 

rocknrollsisyphus

We all go a little mod sometimes.
★ MOD
Feb 9, 2011
17,091
19,661
I'd really like your take on Alex Verdugo and Yadier Alvarez
Verdugo has one of the best hit tools in the minors - I put a 70 on it without hesitation. He has great contact skills and a damn good approach, and he doesn't have a worrisome platoon split, either. He's also a strong defender in center, with average range and a great arm.

The question with Verdugo is how much power he can hit for at the highest level. His raw is maybe average or a tick above, but he doesn't really get to it in games. He's a line drive hitter that doesn't get much loft, so it's tough to see him hitting more than 12 to 15 homers without changing something. That's not a huge issue for a good defensive CF that can hit .300, get on-base at a well above-average rate, and run the bases well - but he's not going to be a superstar.

Alvarez has absurdly good stuff. His fastball and slider are both 60-plus offerings, if not better, and he has surprisingly good feel for his changeup. I think that could be a plus pitch in time, too. He's a big, athletic pitcher, too, and he seems to be built for durability; solid mechanics help that, too.

The issue is that his mechanics are super inconsistent, which leads to him struggling with command and even tipping his tipping his pitches. That makes him prone to way more hard contact than his stuff should allow, especially in the low minors. It's correctable, and when he's on he looks like an ace, but he has work to do.

Both guys are top-100 prospects, for what it's worth.
 

NBAman619

Draymod Green
Oct 3, 2005
106,130
48,575
Who are one under the radar guys (by non prospect hounds) that will show up on top 100 lists that weren’t on there last year? Preferably players who weren’t drafted last year.
 

rocknrollsisyphus

We all go a little mod sometimes.
★ MOD
Feb 9, 2011
17,091
19,661
Who are one under the radar guys (by non prospect hounds) that will show up on top 100 lists that weren’t on there last year? Preferably players who weren’t drafted last year.
Scott Kingery, Phillies
Estevan Florial, Yankees
Fernando Tatis, Jr., Padres
Forrest Whitley, Astros
Adonis Medina, Phillies
Will Smith, Dodgers
Bryse Wilson, Braves
Jon Duplantier, Diamondbacks

These guys aren't really under the radar at this point, but they're all players that broke out in a big way last year that I think are for real. And one of them, Whitley, might be my top overall pitching prospect; Tatis will flirt with my top-15 or so, too.
 
Last edited:

UncleBen59

No Longer a Noob
Jan 26, 2014
5,898
1,030
Massachusetts
I kinda want to hear your thoughts on two of the Red Sox's top prospects in Groome and Chavis but I also want to hear your thoughts on Sam Travis. Travis seems to be lost in the mix between the majors and minors.
 

rocknrollsisyphus

We all go a little mod sometimes.
★ MOD
Feb 9, 2011
17,091
19,661
I kinda want to hear your thoughts on two of the Red Sox's top prospects in Groome and Chavis but I also want to hear your thoughts on Sam Travis. Travis seems to be lost in the mix between the majors and minors.
Groome and Chavis are the Red Sox top two prospects, without much hesitation. And both will probably be in my top-100.

Groome has a 60 or better fastball with plus velocity and plus movement, but he hasn't been able to hold velocity deep into games. That's not uncommon for a high school pitcher, but it's something to watch - his velocity has dipped into the 80s as early as the 4th inning, and that's more than a bit concerning. His curveball, though, is one of the best of its kind in the minors, and there are times that I want to throw a straight-up 80 on it. I also see and hear good things about his change-up and cutter; neither is there yet, but he has pretty good feel for both.

Groome is an athletic pitcher that maintains his delivery well, and he's built to last (his lat injury notwithstanding. His command can come and go, but it's not a mechanical thing (at least not to my eyes). I actually think he doesn't pace himself well enough, because his velocity and command tend to disappear around the same time. That's a developmental thing that should be fixable, though.

I'm a sucker for bat speed, and that's Chavis' best tool. He has a quick, violent swing and he covers the plate incredibly well, driving the ball to all fields from all zones. He's very aggressive, but he has a solid-average hit tool that allows him to make enough contact to get to his 60 or 65 power. I'd like to see him take a few more pitches, as more advanced pitchers will not give him as many pitches to hit, but he made improvements this year, and I trust him to continue to do so. There's not much speed there, for what it's worth, but he's not a base clogger type.

Defense is Chavis' biggest issue. I don't think he's more than competent at third, and it took a lot of improvement for him to get there. He has the arm strength, but he's a bit of a statue there when it comes to hard hit balls. And if he has to move, it's probably to LF or 1B, which dings his value. The existence of Deverse doesn't impact his ratings at all (I put prospects in a vacuum based on talent, not opportunity) - but it might make the Red Sox move him before they should.

As for Travis ... he's kind of the exact type of prospect that I don't really like. He's a 1B-only type (I don't think he'll be anything more than playable in LF, and I wouldn't want him there) without more than average or slightly above-average power, and that's just not an exciting player. He has a 55 or 60 grade hit tool and a good approach at the plate - but a first baseman that hits .280 or .290 with 15 home runs (maybe more with the juiced ball) seems to be his ceiling.

Who are some of your personal favorite prospects and can you provide a potential major-league comp for each?
Will one do for now? Because I have a pretty good one off the top of my head - Estevan Florial reminds me of Curtis Granderson quite a bit, in terms of his build, approach, and swing. I think the shape of his production will be similar, too.
 

rocknrollsisyphus

We all go a little mod sometimes.
★ MOD
Feb 9, 2011
17,091
19,661
Which Braves pitching prospect is your favorite?
Prepare to be completely and utterly shocked ... it's Ronald Acuna.

Of course it's Acuna. He's arguably the best prospect in baseball, and probably the truest five-tool prospect in all of the minors. His worst tool is either his contact skill or his arm, and both are - at worst - 50s on the 20-80 scale. I love the controlled violence in his swing, though, so I'm inclined to toss a 60 on his hit tool even with the propensity to take bad hacks (though, that usually leads to contact and not whiffs). Honestly, my only hang-up with him is that he's 20, and young players bust all the time. But that's a cop-out.

If you're looking for a non-Acuna favorite, it's Mike Soroka. I think he's the most well-rounded of the Braves stable of excellent pitching prospects. There's not ace upside here, but he has three pitches that I'd throw potential 55s or 60s on in his fastball, curve, and change-up - all of which play up because of his great command profile. He's also a great athlete, and he looked like a man among boys despite being way younger than his competition at Double-A.
 

rocknrollsisyphus

We all go a little mod sometimes.
★ MOD
Feb 9, 2011
17,091
19,661
Will Brandon Marsh ever amount to anything?
Brandon Marsh is an incredibly raw prospect, owing to missing a half-year of development with an injury, and splitting time in HS between baseball and football. He has a pretty high risk factor as a result; it's a high-risk, high-reward profile overall.

That being said, he's one of the best pure athletes in the minors - he's a big, strong, and fast dude, with 60 raw power, a 60 arm, and 70 speed. He's a damn good CF already, and he should be a damn good RF if he fills out and loses some of his speed (or if one of the Angels other CF prospects plays there and/or Trout stays forever). He's 6'4", so I think he will probably add muscle and lose speed, but I think power and speed will be his game forever ... it's just a matter of how much of each there'll be.

He's very aggressive at the plate (and probably too aggressive), but I chalk a lot of that up to inexperience. This'll be a big year for him in that respect.

How did Hunter Greene perform in his first season as a professional?

If you're speaking strictly statistically, "shitty" is probably the best word. The numbers are ugly - though, it was only three appearances, and all of the damage came in one of those games (a 0.1 IP, 6 ER effort - ouch). But he turned 18 three weeks before his first pro appearance, so that's pretty forgivable.

His stuff was as good as advertised, though. He hit triple digits, and made it look easy, and his slider made several guys look silly. Those are two potential 70 grade pitches. His change-up was basically non-existent, though ... but, again, it was three appearances for an 18 year old fresh out of HS.
 
Last edited:

TWownsU

Star
Feb 19, 2008
21,157
5,700
After a strong first stint in the majors, will Jesse Winker's hit tool combined with Cincinnati's ballpark and a juiced ball mask his long underlying weakness, power, enough to make him a decent regular player?
What happened to Corey Ray man?
Any Mariners 'prospects' you like besides an obvious Kyle Lewis?
 

rocknrollsisyphus

We all go a little mod sometimes.
★ MOD
Feb 9, 2011
17,091
19,661
What is your opinion on Estevan Florial? How far away is he and is he really the Yankees 2nd most valuable prospect?
I see Florial as one of the 50 or so best prospects in baseball, so my opinion of him is fairly high. He has four above-average or better tools, in his power (raw might be 65), speed, glove, and arm, and he has the all-around talent to be an All-Star caliber center-fielder. I compared him to Curtis Granderson before, and I think that should give you an idea of how special he can be.

The strikeouts are a concern, but I think that's more a product of him being aggressive than it is of him having holes in his swing. He's also semi-willing to work the count, and he doesn't swing at truly bad pitches all that often. His hit tool might only be average - but if he can hit .250 or .260, everything else will make him a first division regular.

And I do think he's the Yankees second best prospect. I wouldn't expect to see him in the majors until 2019, though.
After a strong first stint in the majors, will Jesse Winker's hit tool combined with Cincinnati's ballpark and a juiced ball mask his long underlying weakness, power, enough to make him a decent regular player?
What happened to Corey Ray man?
Any Mariners 'prospects' you like besides an obvious Kyle Lewis?
I see a lot of similarities between Winker and Alex Verdugo - the key difference, though, is that Verdugo is a good defender in CF, whereas Winker is a passable corner outfielder. That gap in defensive value puts them in completely different categories as prospects, and significantly hinders Winker's value if he doesn't find more power in his swing ... and not just artificially inflated power numbers. As you said, that would certainly mask his lack of pop - but it wouldn't make him better in a comparative sense, when he's merely doing what everyone else is doing.

Winker reminds many people of Nick Markakis, for whatever that's worth.

As for Corey Ray, his bat speed seems to have vanished. I don't really know what the cause of it is, but he has changed his stance several times since turning pro - he added a toe tap, took it away, lengthened his stride, raised and lowered his hands, etc. Is that him? Or the coaches? Or some combination of both? Who the fuck knows ... outside of Ray and the Brewers, I suppose. But the effect is that he can't catch up to good velocity, and he has increasingly large holes in his swing.

Ray has a great deal of work to do, and it'll all start with sorting his swing and stance out. That's not easy, though, so the hope is that his elite athleticism helps.

And do I have to talk about Mariners?

Evan White is an interesting prospect. He's already an elite defensive first baseman, and I think he would be a damn good defender in LF or RF if the Mariners moved him back out there (there's no indication that he will). He's a very good athlete with 55 or 60 grade speed, and a 60 hit tool. Will he hit for power, though? I don't know. I like his swing, but he's another guy that simply lacks loft. A great defensive 1B that hits 15 HR and steals 15 bases could be interesting, though.

I'm also semi-intrigued by Rule 5 pick Mike Ford, formerly of the Yankees. I'd throw a 55 or 60 on both his hit and power, and he has a great approach at the plate (he has more walks than strikeouts in his pro career, and the gap has increased in the upper minors). The problem is that he's a 1B-only guy, and he's not a particularly good one at that. I'd definitely give him the shot over Healy if I was the Mariners, though.

And I like everything I've read about their 2nd round pick last year, Sam Carlson. He's super advanced for a high school pick, with a surprisingly polished change-up. I haven't seen much of him, though.
 

UncleBen59

No Longer a Noob
Jan 26, 2014
5,898
1,030
Massachusetts
This is actually really fun.

To add to my previous one, when would you expect Groome & Chavis to get their call up/earn full time spots assuming everything goes well? And who would be your "under the radar" prospect I should keep an eye on for the Red Sox?
 

rocknrollsisyphus

We all go a little mod sometimes.
★ MOD
Feb 9, 2011
17,091
19,661
This is actually really fun.

To add to my previous one, when would you expect Groome & Chavis to get their call up/earn full time spots assuming everything goes well? And who would be your "under the radar" prospect I should keep an eye on for the Red Sox?
Groome will spend most of this year at 19. I'd be shocked if he was even in the conversation to be called-up before some time in 2020. Chavis, on the other hand, could be ready for a role this season; I'm just not sure where the Red Sox would play him. It's 3B, 1B, or DH for him, as I don't think he has the athleticism to play a passable corner OF role.

As for someone under the radar ... I'm a huge fan of Darwinzon Hernandez, and not just because of his name. He's a left-handed starting pitcher with maybe the lowest arm slot I've seen from a legitimate starting pitching prospect. It definitely fits the 'three quarters' arm slot definition, but it's just about as close to being sidearm as you can get without actually being a sidearmer. His delivery has natural deception in it and his long stride adds to it, so his fastball plays up into the 70 grade range. Toss in a solid change-up and an evolving slider and I can see him being a stud.

Hernandez's issue right now is his control, which is ... not good. Though, to be fair, he cut his walk rate from 16.1% to 10.9% without sacrificing strikeouts (25.9% to 25.8%) or being easier to hit (7.3 H/9 to 7.4 H/9). If he can keep his walks around that 4 per 9 mark, I think he can be surprisingly effective.

If you want someone closer to the majors, I'd keep an eye on Jalen Beeks. He's kind of a prototypical 'finesse lefty,' but he started dialing it up into the mid-90s last year (which he hadn't really done since college), so there may be a bit more there. His fastball and change-up are both in the 55 to 60 range, and his curve and slider are fringe average; he keeps the ball on the ground, too. I don't think he's more than a 4th starter, but he's ready now.
 

rocknrollsisyphus

We all go a little mod sometimes.
★ MOD
Feb 9, 2011
17,091
19,661
Who is Keibert Ruiz? Baseball America had him as the Dodgers #3 prospect and this is the first time I've heard his name
He was signed out of Venezuela in 2014. This was his third professional season, and the third season in which he's raked, so it makes sense that he's popping up on lists now that he's done it in full season ball.

Ruiz is a switch hitting catcher, and he looks like a stud at the plate and behind it. He has great bat speed, great contact skills, great arm, and promising pop. He's very, very aggressive, and he's not the smoothest defender - but he's 19. He's a top 100 guy for me.
 

rocknrollsisyphus

We all go a little mod sometimes.
★ MOD
Feb 9, 2011
17,091
19,661
alec hansen: great prospect or greatest prospect?

Sent from my Calcurorn using Tapatalk
I'll go with great prospect.

His fastball and curve both look like 70 pitches, and that's a hell of a one two punch to live off of. I also see his change as a somewhat promising offering, but he has a lot of work to do with it. It's just not even close to consistent. And his command comes and goes, which isn't too surprising for a giant pitcher like Hansen.

I have him as a top 100 guy, and probably the third best in their system.
 

sdevito

Super Star
Nov 19, 2000
50,937
14,146
As for the deal the Yankees didn't get done...

What is the value of Clint Frazier and given that the Yankees have a full rotation, would Cole have moved the needle enough to give up him +?
 

rocknrollsisyphus

We all go a little mod sometimes.
★ MOD
Feb 9, 2011
17,091
19,661
As for the deal the Yankees didn't get done...

What is the value of Clint Frazier and given that the Yankees have a full rotation, would Cole have moved the needle enough to give up him +?
Frazier's value kind of seems to be the great unknown right now. He was justifiably a consensus top-25 prospect heading into 2017, and there's no reason why his stock should be any lower right now. He's still a plus defensive corner OF that could fake it in center, with 70 bat speed and 60 or better power, whose hit tool utility is fringe average. That's a damn good player.

That being said, no team seemed interested in him as the centerpiece of a deal for a pitcher ... and that suggests that his perceived value in the league might be lower. Maybe I'm missing something in his swing? Or maybe his power profile doesn't look as good with power on the upswing? I'm not sure.

Re: the Yankees, I think the idea is that they want as much legit depth as possible. Montgomery at Triple-A is a huge luxury, and he could be a big time piece in another deal. And the guys they were looking at have multiple years left, so it's as much a deal for 2019 as it is for 2018. That being said, I'm not going to be upset if they don't add another starter.
 

rocknrollsisyphus

We all go a little mod sometimes.
★ MOD
Feb 9, 2011
17,091
19,661
Your top prospect (excluding Reyes) and biggest 2018 mover in the Cards' system?
Jack Flaherty is easily their second best prospect. He has four pitches in the 50 to 60 range, and he has a great command and control profile. He's not going to be an ace, but he has a very, very high floor. And if he finds a bit more consistency with the break in his curve, I could see him having a season or two as a Cy Young contender.

I've also always loved Tyler O'Neill. I wouldn't rank him second, but he's a damn good product.

As for a big mover, I really like Junior Fernandez. He has one of the best change ups in the minors, and he flirts with 100 with his fastball. The trouble is that it's a straight fastball, and his slider is a work in progress. But that velo mixed with that change and an average third pitch would be a killer combination ... And I think he could put that together this year.

I'm also a big fan of Randy Arozarena. There are rumors that they're going to let him learn the IF to be a super utility player, and he has the athleticism to do it. Add in a nice power and speed combo and I think he can be a stud bench player (if such a thing exists).
 

rocknrollsisyphus

We all go a little mod sometimes.
★ MOD
Feb 9, 2011
17,091
19,661
Wish the royals had a decent prospect I could bother asking about


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I really like Khalil Lee. He's a no doubt center fielder for me, with 60 raw power and 65 or 70 speed. It's not a great hit tool, but much of his high strikeout rate can be attributed to his patience (as opposed to big holes in his swing). Were it not for his struggles against lefties, which might be caused somewhat by the way he sets his shoulders in his stance, he'd be a slam dunk top-75 guy for me. As it stands, I'll probably have him in my top-100.
 

Ocks-Wifed

Star
Oct 31, 2015
16,087
19,347
Lee getting caught stealing 18 times in 38 attempts is hilariously odd. Like in A ball do they just let players go wild and see what they got?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

rocknrollsisyphus

We all go a little mod sometimes.
★ MOD
Feb 9, 2011
17,091
19,661
Lee getting caught stealing 18 times in 38 attempts is hilariously odd. Like in A ball do they just let players go wild and see what they got?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Pretty much, yeah.
What is your current Top-100 right now @rocknrollsisyphus?
It doesn't exist yet. I've narrowed the list down to around 130 people, and it still has to be ranked. I'm actually using some of these questions to help me crystallize my own thoughts - so thank you for that.
 
Jul 6, 2005
35,040
3,308
Thoughts on Brent Rooker? I enjoyed watching Keith Law go from major hater to begrudging acceptance over the course of the college season to draft day. And then he hit 11 HR in 162 PA in the FSL haha.
 

Ocks-Wifed

Star
Oct 31, 2015
16,087
19,347
Do you believe in Raul Mondesi Jr? I've always been told that it's ok that he's had bad numbers at almost every level cause he has all these tools but when is proof demanded?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

rocknrollsisyphus

We all go a little mod sometimes.
★ MOD
Feb 9, 2011
17,091
19,661
Thoughts on Brent Rooker? I enjoyed watching Keith Law go from major hater to begrudging acceptance over the course of the college season to draft day. And then he hit 11 HR in 162 PA in the FSL haha.
The issue with Rooker is that he is - or should be - a 1B-only player. And that limits his value significantly, and puts more pressure on his bat. That causes many prospect rankers to be down on him out of hand. I don't necessarily buy into that ... but it is a consideration.

That being said, I do buy Rooker's bat. He has 60 to 70 power and drives it to all fields, which prevents teams from shifting against him too dramatically. He also has a better hit tool than his strikeout rate would indicate; though, I have seen him made to look foolish when trying to cover the outer half, so that could be a cause for concern (especially against soft stuff - that'll put his ability to make adjustments to the test). I buy his bat as having value at any position ... it'll just be a matter of how much value, I suppose.

Baseball America comped him to Josh Willingham, for what it's worth. And I can kind of see that.
Do you believe in Raul Mondesi Jr? I've always been told that it's ok that he's had bad numbers at almost every level cause he has all these tools but when is proof demanded?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
It's so freaking hard to analyze anything with Mondesi, because he's been rushed so dramatically. He's only 22, and will be just 22 for the majority of the 2018 season. He was raw way back when everyone was in love with him in 2015 and 2016, and he hasn't really had time to hone his skill due to his shuffling between the minors and majors and between second and short. Much of that is on Mondesi, to be sure - but he's younger than a ton of guys that'll make my top-100, and that speaks volumes.

I don't think his numbers at Triple-A have been bad. He's not a patient hitter, which has caused him most of his problems at the highest level, but he's still a career .305/.338/.538 hitter in 418 Triple-A PA. That's not completely insignificant. But I do think it's time for him to prove his worth at the MLB-level. That'll require the Royals to stop fucking around with him, though, and giving him a chance to play regularly.

To his benefit, Mondesi is a good defender at second and short (though he's completely wasted at the former), and he has terrific bat speed. He's also very athletic, and a very good base-runner. If given the time to develop, I think he can still be a special player. But toolsy shortstops are kind of my kryptonite...
 

rocknrollsisyphus

We all go a little mod sometimes.
★ MOD
Feb 9, 2011
17,091
19,661
I'm bored, so here's my top prospect in each organization*:
  1. Arizona - Jon Duplantier
  2. Atlanta - Ronald Acuna
  3. Baltimore - Austin Hays
  4. Boston - Jay Groome
  5. Chicago Cubs - Adbert Alzolay
  6. Chicago White Sox - Michael Kopech
  7. Cincinnati - Nick Senzel
  8. Cleveland - Francisco Mejia
  9. Colorado - Brendan Rodgers
  10. Detroit - Franklin Perez
  11. Houston - Forrest Whitley
  12. Kansas City - Khalil Lee
  13. Los Angeles Angels - Jo Adell
  14. Los Angeles Dodgers - Walker Buehler
  15. Miami - Sandy Alcantara
  16. Milwaukee - Lewis Brinson
  17. Minnesota - Royce Lewis
  18. New York Mets - Andres Gimenez
  19. New York Yankees - Gleyber Torres
  20. Oakland - A.J. Puk
  21. Philadelphia - Sixto Sanchez
  22. Pittsburgh - Mitch Keller
  23. San Diego - Fernando Tatis Jr.
  24. San Francisco - Heliot Ramos
  25. Seattle - Kyle Lewis
  26. St. Louis - Alex Reyes
  27. Tampa Bay - Brent Honeywell
  28. Texas - Willie Calhoun
  29. Toronto - Vladimir Guerrero Jr.
  30. Washington - Victor Robles
* - I didn't consider Otani for the Angels for two reasons. One, it's boring, and two, he's already played in a major league.
 
Last edited:
Jul 6, 2005
35,040
3,308
Bat only prospects need love too! I understand the consideration but at the same time feel like it serves as a crutch sometimes. Run, glove and arm are the easiest to grade so considering that and most players not panning out you can value those tools heavily and take a generally conservative approach and be less wrong than you would otherwise but not any more right per say. Like the just don't strikeout approach to scouting/prospect writing.

I think your take on Rooker is fair, this is just something I feel I see in general from time to time. Would be interested to hear yours and anyone else's thoughts on this or other things that affect the analysis like consensus thinking, industry biases etc.
 

rocknrollsisyphus

We all go a little mod sometimes.
★ MOD
Feb 9, 2011
17,091
19,661
Bat only prospects need love too! I understand the consideration but at the same time feel like it serves as a crutch sometimes. Run, glove and arm are the easiest to grade so considering that and most players not panning out you can value those tools heavily and take a generally conservative approach and be less wrong than you would otherwise but not any more right per say. Like the just don't strikeout approach to scouting/prospect writing.

I think your take on Rooker is fair, this is just something I feel I see in general from time to time. Would be interested to hear yours and anyone else's thoughts on this or other things that affect the analysis like consensus thinking, industry biases etc.
The issue is largely that first basemen who can hit are really easy to find.

First basemen hit .261/.343/.472 last year, which is good for a 113 wRC+ - the best mark in the majors. The next best position was RF, checking in at .256/.332/.443; that's a 103 wRC+. And that's the norm. First basemen have a 114 wRC+ since the beginning of 2015, and right-fielders are next at 107. League-average is right around 100 (it's not perfect every year, though).

An argument can be made that replacement-level or positional adjustments are overstated, and I can kind of see that. But the baseline level of production at 1B is so much higher than any other position that it simply can't be ignored. There's a greater gap between 1B and RF than there is RF and league-average in two of the last three years ... and RF has the second-best offensive production in the league. That's staggering.

Now, that doesn't make Rooker's bat any less potent; nor does it change the fact that every position on a team needs to be filled. What it does mean, however, is that Rooker is entering the majors with a higher baseline of offensive production, and that will make it harder for him to stand out on a comparative basis.

Phrased differently - I think Rooker can hit .260 with 25 HR regularly. There were 13 first basemen that did that last year, and another seven or eight guys that were within a few points of average or a couple of home runs. That's the field he's entering.
 
Jul 6, 2005
35,040
3,308
I understand. It isn't specifically a Rooker thing but yes you're absolutely right that is the field he's entering. My point is that it also puts even more pressure on being able to accurately grade a hit/power tool and I feel like bat only types can be dinged beyond consideration of a positional adjustment because of one's own uncertainty in grading those two tools whether they would admit it or not. I would be too.

It's the relative praise for these types versus up the middle guys that have plenty of their own flaws that gets me though.

My own biases (and lack of knowledge) are certainly up for debate here but I feel like this might be a bit of a blind spot with potential for someone to take advantage of. Statcast/trackman/hittrax etc. are certainly likely to make an impact here.
 

rocknrollsisyphus

We all go a little mod sometimes.
★ MOD
Feb 9, 2011
17,091
19,661
I understand. It isn't specifically a Rooker thing but yes you're absolutely right that is the field he's entering. My point is that it also puts even more pressure on being able to accurately grade a hit/power tool and I feel like bat only types can be dinged beyond consideration of a positional adjustment because of one's own uncertainty in grading those two tools whether they would admit it or not. I would be too.

It's the relative praise for these types versus up the middle guys that have plenty of their own flaws that gets me though.

My own biases (and lack of knowledge) are certainly up for debate here but I feel like this might be a bit of a blind spot with potential for someone to take advantage of. Statcast/trackman/hittrax etc. are certainly likely to make an impact here.

Aah, okay. I get what you're saying.

I don't know that pure hit tools - as in bat you ball skills - are hard to measure. The difficulties come in when you have to anticipate adjustments that the hitters will make when challenged by major league pitching. Most hitting problems arise when they can't hold off on pitches that they simply can't hit with authority - and that's all but impossible to replicate in the minors, because pitchers with great stuff tend to move quickly. That, and minor league pitchers are almost aways working on something specific in a given start (e.g., not throwing their slider, or having throw a certain number of changeups). Minor league hitters rarely face pitchers that are going all out with their best stuff. That leads more so to poor contact than no contact, though.

But that kind of plays into why bat only guys are naturally limited. If we accept that Rooker will have no value if he can't hit, then his floor is basically the Mariana Trench. If Royce Lewis can't hit, he might still have value as a defensive wonder at short. It's Chris Carter vs. Jose Iglesias, using last year as an example.

I don't think you're wrong with anything you're saying, though. There's almost certainly bias against these sorts of players. I just see it as reasonable, even if it's unfair.
 

sdevito

Super Star
Nov 19, 2000
50,937
14,146
Brett Gardner's trade value fascinates me. It seems at every point in his career, even those who think he has been good have no interest in him going forward. What is a fair prospect to get in return for Brett Gardner.
 

rocknrollsisyphus

We all go a little mod sometimes.
★ MOD
Feb 9, 2011
17,091
19,661
Brett Gardner's trade value fascinates me. It seems at every point in his career, even those who think he has been good have no interest in him going forward. What is a fair prospect to get in return for Brett Gardner.
Who the hell knows?

I would have said a package similar to what the Giants sent to Pittsburgh for McCutchen, and that might still be in play as he's slightly cheaper and has the team option. But trade values have been incredibly wonky this off-season and, even with his superior defense and baserunning, I doubt anyone in the league perceives Gardner as close in value to McCutchen.

In a basic sense, I think he's worth a low-ceiling, high-floor type. In the Yankees organization, that'd be Jake Cave or Nick Solak. Maybe that and a lottery ticket in short season ball.
 
Last edited:

rocknrollsisyphus

We all go a little mod sometimes.
★ MOD
Feb 9, 2011
17,091
19,661
who do you like most in the jays system outside of guerrero, bichette and alford?
Their system slips dramatically after the top three, perhaps more so than any system in the game.

That said, I'm a believer in Conner Greene. His numbers were bad last year, but he has a borderline 80 grade fastball, and I'd throw a 70 on his changeup. Few pitchers start with such an amazing combination, and he has shown flashes with a hard curve, too. If he can straighten out his control, he could be a number two starter. And he has the athleticism and delivery to do it. I'm way higher on him than most, though.

If it's not Greene, it's probably last year's first round pick Nate Pearson. The stuff is there, the control is there ... but his delivery is scary. I don't know how well he can hold up to a larger workload.
 

rocknrollsisyphus

We all go a little mod sometimes.
★ MOD
Feb 9, 2011
17,091
19,661
Give me ALL your thoughts on Heliot Ramos
Short version: he could be the best prospect in baseball this time next year.

Long version: Ramos has ridiculous bat speed, smooth swing mechanics, and the ability to drive the ball with authority from left to right. He has 60 to 65 raw power, and he can hit it out of any park. It's not just pull power, either. He's also an elite athlete, maybe the best in his draft class, and I might throw 70s on his potential for defense in CF and baserunning. There's precious little to dislike.

As with any high school pick, though, he's going to have to show that he can make consistent contact. He didn't show much plate discipline in his pro debut, and that jibes with his reputation in high school. It's perfectly fine to expand your strike zone - but he'll have to learn to tone it down as he climbs the ranks. That being said, I see similarities to Acuna and Robles in his profile, and I'm very, very high on his potential as a franchise player.
 

NBAman619

Draymod Green
Oct 3, 2005
106,130
48,575
Give me ALL your thoughts on Heliot Ramos
Short version: he could be the best prospect in baseball this time next year.

Long version: Ramos has ridiculous bat speed, smooth swing mechanics, and the ability to drive the ball with authority from left to right. He has 60 to 65 raw power, and he can hit it out of any park. It's not just pull power, either. He's also an elite athlete, maybe the best in his draft class, and I might throw 70s on his potential for defense in CF and baserunning. There's precious little to dislike.

As with any high school pick, though, he's going to have to show that he can make consistent contact. He didn't show much plate discipline in his pro debut, and that jibes with his reputation in high school. It's perfectly fine to expand your strike zone - but he'll have to learn to tone it down as he climbs the ranks. That being said, I see similarities to Acuna and Robles in his profile, and I'm very, very high on his potential as a franchise player.
i'm a little turned on right now, not gonna lie
 

UncleBen59

No Longer a Noob
Jan 26, 2014
5,898
1,030
Massachusetts
Out of your top 100-130 prospects, who do you think will pan out the best and who is in danger of becoming a bust? (With variables thrown out, i.e. freak injuries, acquired players, traded multiple times)
 
Last edited:

rocknrollsisyphus

We all go a little mod sometimes.
★ MOD
Feb 9, 2011
17,091
19,661
Out of your top 100-130 prospects, who do you think will pan out the best and who is in danger of becoming a bust? (With variables thrown out, i.e. freak injuries, acquired players, traded multiple times)
The simplest answer to this is to wait and see how my top hundred actually shakes out. I put a fair amount of weight into floor, so I'm confident in my top overall guy, or guys, being big league contributors. But that's also a boring, half-assed answer.

I think Acuna has the best chance to pan out. His tools are off the chart, and he improved at each level while showcasing the ability to make adjustments. That last part is that most difficult part of making it as a major leaguer, so seeing it in a teenager is incredibly promising.

If you want a less obvious name, I'm a big believer in Honeywell. He has four legitimate big league pitches, and he already sequences his pitches brilliantly. You don't often see that in the minors. I honestly think, barring some injury, his floor might be 4th starter. And that's kind of crazy.

As for busts, I think I'm going to be a bit lower than most on Guerrero. He has a great bat, but I worry about his build. He's already lost some athleticism, and I think he's going to end up as a 1B only type. And I could see that impacting his bat, too. He's all fast twitch muscles in his swing ... but adding too much bulk, muscle or not, could mess with his swing. He's still a top 10 guy, regardless.
 

AirNik

Super Star
Dec 9, 2000
104,910
9,238
Your Dreams
Why do Yankees prospects get so underrated? Judge was what... 20 last year? Now Clint Frazier gets treated like dog meat. Gleyber only gets justified attention because he was a Cubs product and the media couldn't be further up Theo's ass (and even he got mysteriously dropped right after changing teams).

Miguel Andujar and Justus Sheffield. Thx.

Thx
 

rocknrollsisyphus

We all go a little mod sometimes.
★ MOD
Feb 9, 2011
17,091
19,661
Why do Yankees prospects get so underrated? Judge was what... 20 last year? Now Clint Frazier gets treated like dog meat. Gleyber only gets justified attention because he was a Cubs product and the media couldn't be further up Theo's ass (and even he got mysteriously dropped right after changing teams).

Miguel Andujar and Justus Sheffield. Thx.

Thx
I don't think that Yankees prospects as a whole are underrated.

Saying that Judge was underrated is probably true - but only to an extent. He looked awful at Triple-A and even worst in the majors in 2016, and he had big-time holes in his swing. Hell, he still has some big holes in his swing. He was obviously Baseball Jesus for most of 2017, so it's easy to say that scouts missed on him entirely ... but, here's the thing, he completely overhauled his swing mechanics in the 2016-17 off-season. He moved further away from the plate, a bit deeper, shifted his weight towards his back hip, and, most importantly, eliminated the violent kick that he was using as a timing mechanism. Those adjustments are not easy to make, but he did it, and did it with more success than most anyone could have hoped for. Looking at prospect rankings after the season he just had makes Baseball America and Co. look stupid - but those rankings were completed before those changes were made.

And Frazier isn't technically a prospect anymore, so he won't appear on any lists. I think the reason that he's treated somewhat differently than his talent dictates is that (1) he has no place on the Yankees roster as constructed and (2) the team has not made their willingness to trade him a secret. That kind of makes him seem like persona non grata. But I don't know how underrated he is - he was dogshit at Triple-A in 2016 and was still a consensus top-40 prospect, and was ranked as high as 16th overall by Baseball Prospectus. He has ridiculous bat speed, 65 power, and should be a damn good defensive corner outfielder ... and I think that's the book on him for most. But his hit tool is definitely a question mark; he's too aggressive, and he overswings on soft stuff.

I also don't know how fair that is to say about Torres. He was ranked 41st by BA and BP heading into 2016, and then 5th and 15th (respectively) heading into this season. And now there are some folk saying that he's in the conversation for the best prospect in baseball. I don't really see a reason to think that his reputation would be any different if he was a Yankee from the beginning.

I'm a fan of Andujar and Sheffield; the latter will definitely be in my top-100. Andujar is kind of borderline for me. I fully buy into his hitting ability, and he's a pretty good base-runner - but he's a sloppy defender, and I'm worried about him playing his way off of third base. It's annoying, too, because he's a good athlete with plenty of arm ... but (I'm guessing) the instincts for the position just aren't there. If he figures it out, though, he could be an All-Star. And Sheffield has very special stuff. It's among the best in the minors, really. But the kid just can't repeat his mechanics on a consistent basis, and it's easy for even the untrained eye to see in-game. He's also looking to be kind of injury prone. He's still probably top-50 (at worst) for me, because I'm a sucker for lefties with his stuff (three potential 60 pitches with good control).